Jonathan Goodman is a bestselling author, entrepreneur, speaker and one of the most influential and well-respected guys in the fitness industry. He is the founder of the Personal Trainer Development Center (the PTDC) and the Online Trainer Academy. He has sold tens of thousands of copies of his books including non-fiction, children, and the first-ever textbook for online fitness trainers. He writes about personal training, online training, and enjoys philosophizing and experimenting with new media. Through The Personal Trainer Development Center Jon helps fitness trainers leverage their expertise to stop trading time for money. He loves fitness, hates bad socks and considers himself to be a key lime pie connoisseur.
In this episode we’ll be discussing how he creates businesses and books from a place of fascination and curiosity. Jon discusses a concept that he calls “the ignorance quotient,” and how it’s key in not being paralyzed by fear. He also shares the fastest, most logical way to replace your income and get to your “freedom number.”
Key Points From This Episode:
- Jon shares his background and how he got into entrepreneurship in the first place.
- Hear how Jon gravitates toward doing stuff that is highly engaging with him.
- Learn what Jon refers to as the ignorance quotient.
- Find out how to find that level of where you have enough information but not too much.
- Listen as Jon tells us how personal training forced him to be entrepreneurial.
- Understand the pros and cons of starting a gym versus scaling online.
- Discover how creating content is what gets Jon excited in the morning.
- Jon tells us about his first book, Ignite the Fire, that he wrote at the age of 24 years.
- Hear how Jon promoted his book, Ignite The Fire, through activation.
- Learn how Jon uses mutual relationships to get noticed by highly respected entrepreneurs.
- Find out how Jon optimizes his life to make it more efficient.
- Listen as Jon tells us how he has tried to master his writing.
- Discover how pen and paper is something Jon is very passionate about.
- Hear more about what Jon has defined as the freedom number.
- Learn to look at what skills you have and what’s the highest yield.
- Find out how to figure out what your skill is.
- Understand what failure means to Jon and how he gets past it.
- Hear Jon talk about how he shut down a membership site that didn’t fit his model.
- Learn how it affected Jon’s business and about his other revenue streams.
- Find out how a certification for online personal trainers is Jon’s biggest revenue stream.
- Discover the biggest mistake that Jon sees up and coming online trainers make.
- Understand how to try a bunch of things but ultimately focus on the main things.
- Hear what social media platforms Jon uses in his business.
- Understand more about Jon’s books and how well they sell.
- Discover why Jon’s wife is the person who has had the most profound impact on his life.
- Find out what’s on the horizon for Jon.
- And much more!
Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:
Jonathan Goodman – http://www.jonathangoodman.ca/
Online Trainer Academy – http://onlinetraineracademy.theptdc.com
Jonathan on Twitter – https://twitter.com/jon_ptdc
Jon’s Book, Ignite the Fire – https://www.amazon.com/Ignite-Fire-Building-Successful-Personal/dp/1505787610/
Jon’s Book, Personal Trainer Pocketbook – https://www.amazon.com/Personal-Trainer-Pocketbook-Reference-Questions/dp/1505839793/
Body and Soul Fitness Toronto – http://www.bodyandsoul.ca/
Dan Demsky – https://unboundmerino.com/
James Altucher – http://www.jamesaltucher.com/
Amazon – https://www.amazon.com/
Audible – http://www.audible.com/
“JG: The first step is to get yourself to what I call free, I mean this free number right? With the buzz word but get yourself to the point where you’re free because once you’re at that freedom number then you can breathe and then your mind can relax and I think that’s the really beautiful tipping point. When you know that you’re taken care of and your people that you love are taken care of, you can fail and that’s - I mean, freedom is providing yourself the opportunity to fail. Like you can fail forward, you can do all these things that business guru’s tell you to do. Try and don’t care if you fail and fail, it makes you stronger. Well that’s nice if you know that failing won’t crush you.”
[0:00:40.1] ANNOUNCER: Welcome to The Fail on Podcast where we explore the hardships and obstacles today’s industry leaders face on their journey to the top of their fields, through careful insight and thoughtful conversation. By embracing failure, we’ll show you how to build momentum without being consumed by the result.
Now please welcome your host, Rob Nunnery.
[0:01:03.6] RN: Hey there and welcome to the show that believes you are destined for more and that failing your way to an inspired life is the only way to get there. Today we’re learning from Jonathan Goodman, Jon’s a bestselling author, entrepreneur, speaker and one of the most influential and well-respected guys in the fitness industry.
Jon loves fitness, hates bad socks and considers himself to be a key lime pie connoisseur. I actually consider myself to be a strawberry cheesecake connoisseur so we’ve got to compare notes but he is the creator of the Personal Trainer Development Center where he helps fitness trainers leverage their expertise to stop trading time for money.
We’ll be discussing how he creates businesses and books from a place of fascination and curiosity. His concept of what he calls “the ignorance quotient” and how it’s actually the key to taking action and not being paralyzed by fear and the fastest most logical way to replace your income if you are currently employed and trying to get to what Jon coins the freedom number.
But first, if you’d like to stay up to date on all fail on podcast interviews and key takeaways from each guest, simply go to failon.com and sign up for our newsletter at the bottom of the page. That’s failon.com.
[0:02:19.2] RN: Hello and welcome to The Fail On podcast, I am sitting down today with Mr. Jon Goodman, he has been nice enough to host us in his office here in Toronto so welcome to the show Jon.
[0:02:29.5] JG: Thanks for making the trip.
[0:02:30.8] RN: Thanks for putting us up in your office right now. Just a little context, what part of Toronto is this? Just so they have an idea?
[0:02:37.9] JG: Yeah, absolutely, this is just west of Toronto, it’s kind of like the border of what’s called Mimico Topico, right on the water. Toronto has got this incredible water front, it’s like a U shape so we’re on the lake and we’re looking across the water at the city, it’s the best place to be.
[0:02:52.2] RN: No, I always loved Toronto, I’ve come probably three or four times this past year and actually the weather’s usually like, I know it’s April now. Weather’s usually better than this.
[0:03:03.0] JG: Yeah. I mean, this is…
[0:03:05.1] RN: This is the guy that spends every winter outside of Toronto.
[0:03:06.1] JG: Right. I was just telling you before we started recording that this is the first year that I’ve been back in six years. I haven’t spent a winter here in a long time so I don’t know what winter is like anymore.
I haven’t put on hockey skates in six years. I picked up a hockey puck yesterday and I was like “yeah, this is what this thing looks like.”
[0:03:21.7] RN: So funny because I was out with some friends last night for dinner and it’s just so different because everybody’s talking about like hockey, because everybody grows up playing hockey, where I’m from in Georgia it’s like baseball or soccer. It’s just so different because hockey’s not even a thing in Georgia.
Although it did have the Atlanta Thrashers for a hot minute.
[0:03:40.6] JG: Yeah, that was unfortunate.
[0:03:44.3] RN: Yeah man, just to hop in to it, why don’t you go through some of your background and what got you into entrepreneurship in the first place?
[0:03:50.9] JG: Sure, I guess if I looked back, I was always kind of an entrepreneur, I never actually worked for anybody else but I studied kinesiology in a university like excess science. I was a personal trainer in a university from years two to four at the university gym and then when I graduated, the goal was always to go into medicine to be honest.
I was like, “I’ll take a couple of years and be a personal trainer full time” and I obviously never went to medicine. I was a personal trainer so I worked for myself. I mean, the best trainers are entrepreneurs, we got to develop our own business.
I kind of hit a point at like 23 years old where I was making as much as I could make as a trainer in Toronto, I was referring my overflow clients to other people, I was managing a group of 10 trainers at that point.
[0:04:25.1] RN: Where were you training people? You don’t have your own gym right?
[0:04:27.1] JG: No, I was training out of a gym called Body and Soul Fitness in Toronto.
[0:04:30.4] RN: It’s your own business, they just…
[0:04:31.5] JG: It wasn’t my business.
[0:04:32.9] RN: Got you, so you were working for them.
[0:04:34.3] JG: I was a contractor for them.
[0:04:35.1] RN: Got it.
[0:04:35.6] JG: I just decided that I needed to figure out a way to make money when I’m not on my feet and wrote a book for trainers at 24 years old and started a website at 25 and now we’re here somehow.
[0:04:46.7] RN: I can relate man, I grew up playing tennis and played tennis in university and then coached afterwards and it’s just like you said, you’re on your feet all day, you have to be enthusiastic, super engaged, it’s taxing work. People don’t feel like tennis coach or a personal trainer, you just stand there.
It’s a lot of mental and physical work actually.
[0:05:05.4] JG: Yeah.
[0:05:05.9] RN: Yeah, along those lines, what made you kind of have the entrepreneurship itch to actually try to scale that into doing something else?
[0:05:15.1] JG: That’s a good question. Hindsight is 20/20 right? I don’t’ really know, I guess if I looked back and I was just kind of making it up as I went, I was very fortunate I graduated that free.
I was able to have a lot of success early on and put a lot of money in the bank early on so I could fail and not really have a lot of risk. I never really knew what an entrepreneur was, like this is before like being an entrepreneur was sexy right? I never knew what it was, I’m from a family where every adult I ever knew was a doctor, a lawyer or accountant, business man, teacher, whatever.
I don’t know. I felt like writing a book so I wrote a book. Then I was like “well, crap, I need to figure out a way to promote this book” so I started a website and then the website just started to grow so I was like, “well this is fun.”
That’s kind of what I do now to be honest. I just chase things that are fun and interesting. I mean, there’s some strategy involved obviously but for the most part, it’s whatever is highly engaging with me. I mean, I think – there’s not that much to it, I wish that there was like a masterplan that I could like, “you see, I had all of this balls in my cord and I organized them strategically”. No.
I just kind of piled – I just produced stuff and piled stuff because it was fun.
[0:06:29.4] RN: It’s an important lesson right? Because I think a lot of people get paralyzed by thinking they have to have that masterplan when in reality, you just put one foot in front of the other and actually do something right? Take the first step.
[0:06:41.1] JG: I’ve got this concept that I play around with a lot that I call the ignorance quotient and I don’t know where it is exactly, I haven’t been able to quantify it yet but I feel like one of the plagues today in society is that we know too much, that we have access to too much information and it paralyzes us always thinking that we need to know more before we do something.
I’m of the belief that there was probably a point where you need to know enough about something and then just so you don’t really screw up right? Anything beyond that is actually a disservice.
[0:07:11.5] RN: How do you find that level of where you know you have enough information but not too much where you’re stuck.
[0:07:17.6] JG: I think you find that level, again, I haven’t been able to quantify this, I’d actually love to quantify it somehow.
[0:07:22.2] RN: it would be so cool, yeah.
[0:07:23.9] JG: I believe that that level is somewhere between knowing what action to take next, like being able to basically map out a trajectory but also being able to really stave off any fear and fear is simply an irrational response to the unknown.
If you can make the unknown known or you can identify the worst case scenario then there’s no fear. I think it’s kind of a combination of those two but I haven’t quite figured that out yet.
[0:07:54.2] RN: I think I know you said, you graduated debt free all that, so your worst case scenario was probably not that bad right? You could probably live at home if worst came to worst. You can get a job, with personal training, because I’ve talked to a few different guys, it’s a skillset where you can trade time for money and made probably pretty good money right?
Maybe it’s not scalable but you can pay your bills. I think it’s a great way to get into business by having a skill like that where you can make hourly money on your own terms and have other time to figure stuff out.
[0:08:26.1] JG: Yeah.
[0:08:26.6] RN: Was that a huge help for you?
[0:08:29.0] JG: I think personal training, it’s just a perfect job for somebody getting started. It forces you to be entrepreneurial, number one. You have to drive your own business. I don’t care where you work, you’re driving your own business, you’re working for yourself. It forces you to be good with people, it forces you to build really strong relationships. People don’t buy training, they buy trainers right? It forces you to build great relationships with people and it forces you at a certain point to really understand the value of time.
Because any good trainer will get to that point where like “well crap, I cannot physically work anymore hours. I can’t be on my feet, what the heck do I do” and at that point, time management is basically all of it. Armed with those skills, I mean, you can do anything else. Those are kind of the intangible.
[0:09:12.3] RN: Why did you – I know you said you had maybe like 10 other trainers working for you at one point right?
[0:09:18.2] JG: I was managing them, they weren’t working for me, it wasn’t my gym but I was the senior trainer at that club yeah.
[0:09:22.3] RN: Got it. Why do you think it’s better or do you think it’s better for people that are – you only have so many hours in the day to train, one on one or group or whatever. Do you think it’s better to scale kind of online, like the route you went or actually start a gym, hire trainers. What are the pros and cons there and did you consider doing that?
[0:09:42.1] JG: I never wanted to open up a gym, I just knew it wasn’t right for me, I don’t’ know why it just never was anything that appealed to me. I took the job as a senior trainer, as the manager at like 23 years old. I was the youngest trainer by seven years when I took that job at the club.
It was largely an eagle play, it’s like Peter Principle right? Everybody is promoted to a level whether not good at their job anymore. Why did I do that? I mean, what’s the best way to go? I think it’s different for everybody. I think it’s just super important to know yourself especially more and more today.
For me, yeah, the right decision, I like producing stuff, I never knew that about myself.
[0:10:19.4] RN: Creation?
[0:10:20.3] JG: Producing stuff.
[0:10:21.3] RN: Like content, et cetera?
[0:10:22.4] JG: Creating. But not even creating content, creating product. That’s what gets me excited in the morning. You know, writing books and not just writing books but like writing beautiful books and interesting books and different books like you know, I hired a cartoonist for one, I wrote a text book and within the text book, we did all this things that you would never see in a text book before.
We meshed it together with digital portal and all this different physical fulfillment. Stuff you could never do. You know, even 10 years ago because now you can self-publish this stuff and find your own distributors and printers and stuff like that. That’s what I love.
I think when I found that, when I started writing the first book I was like “yeah, this is it I never knew that.”
[0:11:04.5] RN: How many years ago was it that you wrote that first book and what was it?
[0:11:07.6] JG: I was 24 years old so that would have been seven years ago and that book was called Ignite the Fire. The Secrets to Building a Successful Personal Training Career. That book’s in version 2.0 now but it’s being translated to Chinese, it’s already in Spanish, its mentorships, colleges around the world like “some idiot 24 year old decided to write a book although educating his industry and the gumption in that” and I did it because I was too ignorant not to do it.
[0:11:33.8] RN: yeah, often the best right?
[0:11:35.8] JG: Exactly, I knew so little about what you should do that I was just like, “I’m going to write a book” and I did.
[0:11:41.7] RN: Because you had no limitations or expectations on what could and could not be done right?
[0:11:46.8] JG: Sure.
[0:11:47.3] RN: You just said “screw it”?
[0:11:48.8] JG: Pure ignorance and it’s bliss. I keep going back to that moment, I’m like how – what did the old guard in the industry think of me, this like again this….
[0:11:59.9] RN: And you didn’t have a platform at this time right?
[0:12:01.3] JG: Nothing.
[0:12:02.8] JG: Nothing. I was working in a small boutique gym in a little corner of Toronto with no network and I was like, I’m going to type some keys and find an editor and publish this book and like, I reached out to – this was the person, I wrote this book basically every night, every day during the day, I had a page on the back of my clipboard where I just wrote down everything I did and then at night I would just type that up and like a section.
I realized I needed to get an editor so I reached out to everybody who I knew that had written a book in my industry that I felt was good, I asked them for an introduction to their editor, everyone said yes. I took all the money that I had, I hired an editor and I navigated the publishing process and I just like put out a book and sent copies to – I just again, sent cold emails to people and I was like, “hey, can I send you a copy of my book?”
[0:12:48.3] RN: That was seven years ago? Did it sell right off the bat?
[0:12:51.4] JG: It did because I guess I didn’t tell the story chronologically, exactly right. The book came out like September, October. I started a website called The Personal Trainer Development Center in March.
That website, I started publishing other people very early. It’s still you know, in existence today and it’s become the largest curated independent platform for trainers for information. It was all based around one principle which is I only know so much but there’s a lot of other people who know a lot about little, why don’t we just bring everybody in one place?
I started just reaching out to people and basically created this platform where everybody could benefit. I did have a bit of a platform when the book came out but more than anything else, I just started supporting other people like I just – every single Sunday and I still do it to this day, I just published a list of the best articles I found on the net in the fitness industry.
Now you have relationships with these people. Enough to send them a copy of your book and if it’s good you know? The goal of any first book is to get it in the hands for critical mass of people and then kind of once that happens…
[0:13:56.4] RN: Once you developed relationships with the other people, they were promoting the book to their list or what? How did that look?
[0:14:02.7] JG: It wasn’t that organized, I mean, I sent him a copy of the book and one thing that I did is even at that point, a couple of other people had sent me copies of their books and they’d been published by publishers and I hated getting them. Because I hated the lack of tact and personality that they put in it.
You get a book and for anybody who is in this situation where you get sent a lot of books, you get a book from somebody that’s sent from a publisher. You get this jokey form letter that is not personalized to you at all. It’s like,” hello, here is your copy of the book, please read it and share it on social media in this three ways, here is a message to promote the book.”
Then it’s just a copy of the book like that. For anybody busy, it’s like” look, I like you but I don’t have time to read your 300 page book necessarily.”
[0:14:49.7] RN: And you put zero effort and care into wanting to get me to.
[0:14:54.3] JG: One of the things that I did is I took the book and I’ve done this with all of my books is, I wrote a personal letter to everybody who is getting a package. In the book itself, I found a page or a section that that person would be specifically interested in. I might highlight or even annotate the book in that section like calling them out to a certain part of that section. I put a sticky note in the page of the book with their name with a line down and in the letter, I just made note of that and I just said “hey, so and so Jeff, I think you’ll love this one section of the book, open it to page 174.” Just made it super easy for them to at least crack open a spine, for anybody who understands software applications like that’s activation.
[0:15:32.7] RN: Yeah, exactly.
[0:15:34.0] JG: I mean, you get them to take one action once they’ve cracked open a spine, you make it as easy as possible for them to take that action.
[0:15:39.1] RN: Take out all the friction.
[0:15:41.1] JG: Then if again, if that’s good, then they might read the other book, even if they don’t, they’ve at least – they’ve at least experienced it enough to say hey, this thing is pretty good right? They’re willing to put their name to it a little bit. But I didn’t pay anybody.
[0:15:56.1] RN: Did somebody tell you to do that or is that something you just thought of as you were going through the process. “This is a great way to get people to…”
[0:16:01.4] JG: No, that was just if I wanted people to crack – I didn’t know the term activation at that point.
[0:16:07.7] RN: Strategic necessarily. You had this earlier, you didn’t have this grand plan, it was just like the right thing to do. Got it.
[0:16:15.2] JG: Nothing is strategic with me, I mean, things might seem that way for anybody who follows my stuff, they might see it. For me, it’s just – I think as a trainer it was this way too, I’ve always been very good at kind of putting myself in the other person’s shoes and saying, “what is it that – how are they going to experience this thing? What are they going to be doing at that time and how can I basically get them to want to do what I want them to do?”
With fitness it was that way, as a personal trainer, how can you get somebody to want to do an exercise that you want them to do? With social media, I’ve written a book on social media, it’s the same thing, how can you get somebody to want to share a message that you want them to share. You don’t ask them to do it, you know what the priorities are and I think it’s just always kind of been that way.
Then just like being a good person. I mean.
[0:17:02.6] RN: Right.
[0:17:03.4] JG: Somebody sends you a book, do you want a form letter that’s kind of jokey and just tells you to share it even though you don’t really know the person, no, you like want to note, reminiscing about a story of that one time when you spent a night with that person, like going for a meat fest or whatever.
[0:17:20.1] RN: Yup, totally agree and I think it’s a long the same lines, I think it’s a similar, there’s a similar idea when people are reaching out to get help from other people, whether it’s mentorship or people you just want to connect with. Especially guys with big social media influence, people reach out to them all the time and it’s a conversation I’ve had with a few people.
What’s the best way to get your attention or if you want to reach out to somebody that you highly respect in entrepreneurship or fitness or whatever. What’s a strategy that you would take in terms of trying to get noticed by that person and get a response? People that are super busy obviously.
[0:18:00.0] JG: One way, I mean, the way that you did it is go through somebody that you know the person has a good relationship with. Buddy Dan Demsky who showed up at this point.
[0:18:09.0] RN: He was trying to give you one.
[0:18:09.8] JG: The best shirts on the planet dude.
[0:18:11.7] RN: I love his business so much, we talked yesterday actually. It’s like, I talked about the entire interview was how much I love your business.
[0:18:21.3] JG: It’s so smart, I mean, I’ve been traveling. So my buddy Dan owns this company, Unbound Merino, it’s merino wool clothing and he does it a lot more affordable and for anybody who travels a lot, they know that merino wool is the best material and it was super expensive up until now and Dan somehow figured a way to make it a little bit less expensive.
Nice fitting clothing, stuff like that. Anyway.
[0:18:43.0] RN: Have you basically…
[0:18:43.7] JG: Basically all I wear. Because all I wear is black phoenix. I’m a uniform guy. I try to reduce as many decisions as I possibly can over the course of my day and my life and one of them Is clothing.
[0:18:55.8] RN: What are some other outs that you do? In terms of just optimizing your - making your life more efficient.
[0:19:02.0] JG: Sure, I mean it’s getting an office like the one that I did here just to separate home and not home. I just don’t deal with stuff that doesn’t matter. I wish I could make it, I have such an absurd filter on what matters and what doesn’t matter.
[0:19:17.8] RN: that seems like the opposite of a lot of entrepreneurs, a lot of entrepreneurs have like super ADD, shiny object syndrome, they’re all over the place. How do you.
[0:19:25.8] JG: I’ll give you an idea. I know – I’ve traveled the last five years, like six months or over a year more or less and I’ve gone to a lot of places throughout the world and the north America too like we hiked in 16 national parks in Canada and the United States and the reason why my platform is entirely built on text and on articles is simply because, if I used any audio or video an in built platform based off of that.
Then it would seriously limit my ability to live life the way that I want to live it because I wouldn’t be able to go to remote places the way that I do and know that I would be able to work with audio and video.
I guess those kinds of decisions, “what do I really want, what’s really important” and then that focus again has been great because if you try to do all of these things, you’re going to do none of them well. We do text and we do written stuff better than anybody else for our audience.
I don’t touch, go to my YouTube channel, I think I got four videos right? They’re basically like videos of podcasts that I did with other people where they gave me the video and I’ve never done anything audio with it than appeared on podcasts here and there when it works.
[0:20:34.0] RN: All by design, not just because you don’t want to, just purely because you want to live life on your terms.
[0:20:38.9] JG: Because what’s important to me is to be able to produce great work and again, I know that producing product, getting really beautiful things out into the world is what really matters. Another digital thing isn’t really going to change anything for anybody else but also isn’t going to hedge myself and create this long-lasting impact that I want to create.
You get a book on somebody’s shelf that’s beautiful, that they go back and read four times like that is super powerful, that’s not easy to do. You need to be able to think very clearly in order to produce that kind of stuff and being able to think clearly is harder and harder these days
[0:21:22.9] RN: It’s a great point because how do you feel like you’re writing has gone, I could hear doing a podcast or doing YouTube videos and instructional stuff all the time. You wouldn’t be as good of a writer as you are right?
[0:21:35.2] JG: No.
[0:21:35.3] RN: How have you honed that craft or writing? Obviously you just kind of winged it at first, I’m sure you had…
[0:21:40.5] JG: I’m still winging it.
[0:21:41.5] RN: But I’m sure you had some talent. How have you really tried to master your writing. Obviously there’s not an end but you get better and better.
[0:21:48.3] JG: Sure, I think it’s just finding your voice more than anything else. I mean, I don’t – I’d be grudgingly called myself an author like two years ago when I had written three good books and five books total, up until that point.
I think it’s just – I mean yeah, I read a bunch of books on writing, practiced and practiced but I think a lot of the kind of winging writing is where you become better, where there’s no stress. I feel like, “I’m going to write a book and this is my chapter for the book.”
There’s a lot of stress in that versus I’m just going to – I probably publish 2% of what I write. Most of the stuff that I write is very much selfishly written for me.
[0:22:26.8] RN: How much do you write?
[0:22:28.5] JG: I mean, every day, I try to write some, you can see I’ve got a couple of notebooks on my desk there. It’s sometimes little, sometimes a lot. My best trick is you just start and a lot of good writers will say this. I can’t remember who it was, maybe it was Hemingway or something would never end a writing session at the end of a chapter.
[0:22:45.5] RN: Leave a cliffhanger, right?
[0:22:47.2] JG: You would always leave a cliff hanger. I’ve taken that to heart where, at the end of chapter but if I’m over sending down, I don’t know what I’m going to write, I’ll write the words I don’t know what I want to write so I’m just going to write and see what happens.
[0:22:59.3] RN: Yeah, sure.
[0:23:00.0] JG: Then you just fly.
[0:23:01.0] RN: Yeah, then just keep going right?
[0:23:03.0] JG: I mean, it’s as long as you don’t have a blank page, something also that I’m very passionate about is pen and paper.
[0:23:08.0] RN: Yeah. Do you do everything pen and paper then put it on the computer?
[0:23:10.4] JG: I always start pen and paper.
[0:23:12.1] RN: Interesting.
[0:23:12.6] JG: I always start pen and paper. Usually it never makes it to the computer to be honest, if it’s really good then sometimes I’ll take a picture and send it to my assistant who will type it up. If it’s something that I think might be like a book then I’ll usually, we type it on the computer, simply because that’s like part of process of how I improve that.
It’s just about anything, it really doesn’t matter, I used to sit in the park and I would write back stories about people who would walk by.
[0:23:38.9] RN: That’s cool, yeah.
[0:23:41.5] JG: I’ve been out with friends and stuff like that and they’ve just asked me to do it. Somebody walk by and they’re just like, “what’s the story on that?” You just make up like this ridiculous long, winding. Like old Jewish grandfather, never-ending story about that person right?
[0:23:53.4] RN: That lets you hone a really amazing skill. Just the art of storytelling right?
[0:23:58.2] JG: It’s just fun.
[0:23:58.7] RN: Yeah.
[0:23:59.6] JG: It’s fun, there’s so much of you know, “you need to do this because it’s strategic, because it’s business”, it’s like “no. You need to have fun” and I think what we’re seeing in the business world too is the businesses that are being really disruptive that are growing super fast.
Businesses with a legitimately have fun. I read a story the other day of the creator of Cirque De Soleil and he was in his office and their company of course, have grown a ton and he hired a new employee because he thought that his office was getting boring and it was a clown.
The only job of this new employee was just to clown in the office all day. I mean, I feel like more people do that. There are more people need stuff like that just like joke around, be idiots. Loosen up because that’s when the magic happens.
[0:24:50.5] RN: I can imagine some people are sitting there thinking to themselves, okay, like you had this personal training business right out of school, you didn’t have any debt, you had less stress and you’re obviously a very easy going guy.
People might be thinking, yeah, it’s easy for you to say that right? To have fun and like the business will come to you and it will grow and it will be magical and you can write and…
[0:25:12.1] JG: Be magical and everybody – yeah, of course.
[0:25:14.2] RN: Butterflies. I’m sure there’s people sitting there and you know, in dire financial situations where it’s hard for them to have fun because they’re so worried and stressed about the financial situation.
What would you say to them in terms of, if it’s somebody that maybe has a job but they’re unhappy, super unhappy, not living the life they want but they have potential and something they want to do, what would you recommend?
[0:25:36.4] JG: This is – I help a ton of personal trainers with this in my business and the first step to fixing any problem is defining a problem. I think that a lot of people in that situation and look, I’m fortunate that I’ve never been in it but I’ve helped a ton of people out of it and they haven’t defined the problem.
This concept was passed down by a mentor of mine. The other benefit of being a personal trainer is you get to work with people way smarter than you that would never give you their time of day and you get to spend like hours one on one with them.
This guy is still a good friend, he was the Chief of Psychiatry at one of the major hospitals in Toronto, brilliant guy, entrepreneurial guy, everything right? He passed down this very simple concept to me that I’ve now renamed the freedom number.
The freedom number is the amount of money that you need each month to pay your rent, to pay off any dependents, I mean, this could be debt and basically like the minimum that you need to survive each month.
There is your definition of a problem. How many people listening to this right now actually know what that number…
[0:26:33.9] RN: Have actually defined that? Yeah.
[0:26:34.6] JG: How much money do you actually need a month to pay off any debt that you might have and to take care of anybody that you need to take care of if there are any dependents.
What’s that number? Figure out that number, that’s step number one. Step number two is to figure out what you’re doing each day to make – what you need to each month to make that amount.
[0:26:55.3] RN: Just so it’s clear, let’s say $5,000 a month. So now what’s next step?
[0:27:00.3] JG: Okay, the next step is to figure out how to make that $5,000 so if you’re an employee, it’s a little bit more difficult, I obviously work with personal trainers who charge an hourly rate and get paid an hourly rate so the equation becomes much easier.
[0:27:11.8] RN: let’s say you have a job that’s paying you a bit under 5,000? Let’s say you’re getting 4,000 a month post tax and you need to bridge that gap and start off by making an extra 1k a month.
[0:27:23.2] JG: Sure.
[0:27:23.1] RN: That’s your goal. What would you recommend in terms of getting started, for someone that doesn’t have an idea really?
[0:27:28.4] JG: Somebody who doesn’t have an idea, you look at what skills you have. The first step is to do whatever you can do that’s highest yield you know? Everybody talks about passive income and accessory income streams and stuff like that.
To me, all that stuff comes later, the first step is to get yourself to what I call free, I mean this freedom number right? with the buzz word but get yourself to the point where you’re free because once you’re at that freedom number then you can breathe and then your mind can relax and I think that’s the really beautiful tipping point.
When you know that you’re taken care of and people that you love are taken care of, you can fail and freedom is providing yourself the opportunity to fail. Like you can fail forward, you can do all of these things that business gurus tell you to do. Try and don’t care if you fail. Failing makes you stronger, it’s like “well that’s nice if you know that failing won’t crush you, right?” that’s not to seem to leave a thing, you’ve got to mitigate loss maximize potential gain.
So what can you do? Usually its service based, what can you do to start even if it’s not passive, even if it’s not the most scalable that is as high yield as possible to get you to that freedom number that you’ve established for yourself and then do that, right?
There’s other people who teach this really well online. I just work with the trainers but like, whatever your skill is whether you have some skills in social media management, whether you can clean houses, whatever it is.
[0:28:54.9] RN: What if somebody says they don’t have a skill, they probably just have blinders on them. They don’t realize what they actually are capable of but let’s say no fitness background, no –
[0:29:05.7] JG: Everybody has a skill. The easiest way to figure it out is to do exactly what I did years back when I was writing the book. Every single day you walk around and you have a pen and paper in your pocket. You could use like James Altucher like his way to a pad thing if you want something that fits in your pocket. I had a clipboard so it was easier and on a page of it, all that you do is write down everything you do.
If you pick up a piece of garbage you write it down, if you say hello to somebody you write it down because all of those things are scales. What set my book initially apart in the fitness industry was the relationship aspect, was the belief that I didn’t even know that I knew at that point where the importance of a quality of a program pales in comparison to the importance of your ability to get somebody to want to do that program and I never knew about all of that stuff.
But how do you interact with people? How do you say hello to people? Look at all these things that are marketed online, how do you negotiate your phone bill? People have written ebooks on that, right? I mean all of those little things like, can you coach somebody in something that you do and I don’t know what the answer for that is for an individual person. I think the only way to do it is to really again define the problem. We have way too many solutions and we have way too few good questions.
And that is such a huge issue. We need to ask better questions and we can’t ask questions until we know what the problems are. So that’s step number one.
[0:30:34.2] RN: So I know you mentioned failure and it’s tough to take a risk and not be afraid of failure if you feel like it is going to crush you right? So one, what does failure mean to you and then two, how do you get past that? How do you get past that big fear of just –
[0:30:52.5] JG: Failure to me is acting emotionally. The only time when I have really regretted anything that I have done is when I acted without tact, is when I’ve acted emotionally and I now have a series of what I call objective filters that guides what I do which are a series of predetermined logical questions that I ask myself when I encounter any situation and that allows me to take a step back and say, “Okay run through my questions” right? As oppose to even before I comment something on Facebook, I always go through those questions.
[0:31:21.8] RN: Yeah, what are they?
[0:31:22.6] JG: I have to list them for you because there’s 10 or 11. We could put them in the show notes. This is a book concept that is working its way somehow through myself but failure to me for the most part is not understanding the ramifications of something and you always talk about fear. One of my favorite quotes is by Seneca and I will paraphrase, “If you wish to put off all fear imagine what’s the worst that could happen, most definitely will happen”.
Fear is irrational. Fear is nothing but a response to not knowing what might happen. So if you can define what will happen, what is the absolute worst case scenario of what is going to happen if you take action in those things? And usually what most people find is that once you have established what the worst case scenario of that thing is, they’re like, “Well that’s not too bad. All right let’s do it” but if you don’t know that then you’re scared.
[0:32:21.7] RN: It goes back to defining it right? I think a lot of people will just act without really breaking down the situation and actually defining what it is you want to do and you’re scared of.
[0:32:30.7] JG: For sure. I deeply believe that. I mean all of the things that I have done in the last six years, I’ve put out something like five books. A textbook, a certification, four conferences, a couple of online products, I did a fitness comic that failed, I did a blog that failed, another blog that failed, oh god, I had three or four partnerships that was supposed to do stuff that didn’t happen. The amount of things that we have tried to do in the last number of years – I just shut down a membership that had 980 members at 40 bucks a month. It just wasn’t working.
[0:33:09.6] RN: What wasn’t working about it?
[0:33:11.0] JG: I didn’t think that it offered a good enough service to the members. I didn’t feel like it differentiated from other things in the market place. I felt like people signed up for it because they trusted me and they trusted our company and they liked our company and they stayed there because they liked our company and they wanted to support our company versus we were offering them something that was truly special worth a hundred times what they were paying.
[0:33:34.0] RN: You didn’t feel like that was something that you could curate?
[0:33:36.2] JG: I think that that’s something that we could curate but I know what we’re developing now with the company will serve them so much more and that membership platform is nothing but a distraction from what we are building.
[0:33:48.2] RN: Did you take them from that platform to something new or did you just turn it off? You said it was 40 bucks of almost a 1,000 people?
[0:33:55.0] JG: It was 30 to 40 bucks depending on when they signed up.
[0:33:57.1] RN: So you were looking at 30 to 40K in a reoccurring monthly revenue.
[0:34:00.0] JG: Yeah.
[0:34:00.6] RN: And so did you move them to another revenue stream or did you just shut it down?
[0:34:04.7] JG: Cut it.
[0:34:05.4] RN: Got it.
[0:34:05.6] JG: Cut, downloaded all of the content from it, made sure they had everything that we’ve produced and actually today is the first day that it is completely shut off, end of March done because it didn’t fit into the model, right? It’s got to fit your model.
[0:34:19.4] RN: How does that affect your business? What are your other revenue streams and did that make a big dent in your business or okay?
[0:34:24.5] JG: Look, that was part of it too when we looked at our numbers we realized that was nothing in our business’s revenue streams. I mean one online platform in the community, so there is a lot of revenue streams from various, I don’t do a ton of affiliate partnerships but I’ve got a couple of key partnerships with other companies that we support, stuff that we just don’t plain do that they do. Fortunately my books are self-published and for anybody who self-publishes knows that you can make a fair bit of money self-publishing books if you are able to sell and the book sell quite well.
[0:34:54.0] RN: On Amazon mainly?
[0:34:54.9] JG: All on Amazon mainly and then bulk orders and the ones that are translated, I don’t even know how any of that works but –
[0:35:01.6] RN: What’s your biggest revenue stream in terms? Is it a course, a book?
[0:35:04.4] JG: It’s a certification that I developed. I developed the first ever certification for online personal trainers and I wrote a textbook on it and I created the certification on it. So we release that twice a year.
[0:35:14.5] RN: And that’s for them to be a certified personal trainer basically so it’s not –
[0:35:18.1] JG: Certified online trainer. So it’s an accessory certification. It’s not your baseline cert.
[0:35:25.5] RN: Is that to train virtually?
[0:35:26.8] JG: Yeah, so it’s how to be responsible to training clients online. We call them insta-trainers. You see all of these Instagram trainers and stuff like that selling their clients and stuff, there are incredible ways that you can develop a responsible business working with clients online, getting them to adhere program, take care of clients remotely and I won’t get into obviously the ends of notes here but there’s incredible ways that you can do it if you really understand the business model.
But a lot of people who are doing it now because it has grown so quickly that aspect of the fitness industry, they are just throwing out workouts and what most people don’t understand once they go online is just because you are working online doesn’t mean you are working smarter. You can very easily work more hours for less money online with a bad business structure and by overpromising like, “Hey, here is unlimited email support” no.
[0:36:18.5] RN: Yeah, exactly and you’re doing all of it.
[0:36:20.2] JG: Don’t do that bro.
[0:36:22.2] RN: On that note, what is the biggest mistake that you see up and coming online trainers make? What’s the one thing that you see as a commonality that they always screw up?
[0:36:32.0] JG: Copying other people.
[0:36:33.6] RN: Just not being their selves?
[0:36:34.8] JG: Just copying other people’s businesses thinking, “Oh this person who maybe I like” or “Maybe I think from my vantage point by comparing my blue post to their highlight wheels, maybe it looks like they are doing really good stuff so they must know everything” and so copying your posts and structure or copying the way that they do their sales, copy all that kind of stuff and I’m like, “Most people have no idea what the heck they’re doing” because that post that they have copied from somebody else who also didn’t know what they were doing. It is an industry that is fast evolving but it is still new. There are no precedents to it.
[0:37:10.8] RN: That’s an interesting point because a lot of times you hear people say, “Okay look at the model that works or a business that’s successful, model after it, put your own twist on it but you are saying some of these businesses were ripped from other people. So what if somebody sees your model, they see, “Okay this is working for John. He’s crushing it, he’s making it work” you don’t think it’s good for somebody to kind of obviously not completely rip off your business but just have the same structure and ideas.
[0:37:40.8] JG: Quite happy for anybody to copy my business. I know how it is, if you can do it, all the power to you man. I get what you’re saying, I don’t think that it is a bad thing to do. I think just again what’s most important is to really establish what is right for you. So to say, “Okay they are doing this, why are they doing that? Does that work for me? What do I want to get out of this?” even something as simple as going back to the online personal training thing, how are they developing their packages.
What services are they offering to clients and how do they get charging for those services? Have they said the service is going to take me this many minutes per month to deliver in this many minutes and this many minutes? We’ve got very in depth calculators of how to calculate this but I want to offer these things. I know that I need this much money. I know that I have this many hours per month meaning that I need to charge this amount of money per hour.
So based off of what I want to provide in each package, how many hours is it going to take me to deliver? Does it fit into what I determine to be my hourly rate and if it skewers either low or high then you adapt that. That’s what’s important. It’s the ideal, you know the beautiful thing about working online is you can build the perfect model for you in your life.
[0:38:52.0] RN: It’s like you, you don’t want to do audio-video so you just write.
[0:38:55.6] JG: Sure and there are people who thrive with audio. There are people who thrive with video. There’s people who thrive at Instagram. People who use social networks that I don’t even know exists, right? There are so many ways to do this these days that I think what’s just important is you figure out what works for you, what really gets you jacked up and you put your effort into it.
[0:39:18.1] RN: You have been trying a bunch of different things at first or do you recommend focusing on one thing?
[0:39:22.6] JG: I think you try a bunch of things but very quickly and go throughout them and you just see what kind of seems to make sense for you. The way that you voice your opinions on different platforms changes and that’s natural and once you decide what you want then you go all in to that one. You go deep on that one and then once you’ve got deep and build up the level of success in that then you can start spreading it around.
We went all into Facebook for a number of years. We built up a page of 200 some thousand people. We built up a big following on Facebook, a couple of groups of 15 to 20,000 people and then now we are spreading them across. This is like six years in. So now. We are doing the - and we’re doing it in email list but now we are doing the Instagram. Now we are doing that. If you try to do all of these things at the beginning, you’re just going to dilute yourself. So you build up a big platform on one and then you head yourself.
[0:40:17.0] RN: Sure, that makes sense. Were you focusing on an email list from the beginning?
[0:40:22.0] JG: Yes, always.
[0:40:23.1] RN: Was that the most important? In terms of people focusing on one thing or the other, I mean obviously email is its own beast and own asset, was that the most important thing you built early on?
[0:40:34.1] JG: It was. I am very much on the fence here. I still haven’t figured out what my thoughts are right now. Email used to be a 100% because your deliverability was good, your open rates were good, your click rates are good. Email has gotten too easy to use now and so all of those things have gone down and it’s creating – you are forced to have more and more impressions on a user before they buy anything now and you just can’t create that many impressions with email anymore.
So to be honest, I am just in a period and a process now where I am just hedging. I still think email is probably number one. I mean most of our sales do come through email and I think most people will tell you that but we try to have people on email, on Facebook, on Instagram and even then, I get stuffed on people’s shelves. I don’t know what’s going to happen with the internet. Email used to be safe. It’s like you own the contact.
Well you don’t own the email service provider. You don’t own Gmail and Gmail could be like, “Oh by the way” like Hotmail for example just decided one day they don’t like us. That’s it. We can’t deliver to all Hotmail email addresses and so if that was my only source of business I would be screwed.
[0:41:46.9] RN: Yeah, it’s out of your control.
[0:41:47.8] JG: Exactly. So the only think that I can control are relationships and the only thing that I can control is getting physical materials that are beautiful well thought out that people will want to revisit and gift and get them on people’s shelves. I gave away over a thousand books this week or these two weeks and I sold more than a thousand books but the strategy of that is A, I just like sharing this stuff again because it is fun but also how do we hedge ourselves?
How do we make sure that we’re in the best possible position to win moving forward no matter what happens? We have no idea what’s going to happen. With the economy and with social media and with email, we have no clue and the only thing that I can virtually guarantee is a physical material in somebody’s house is probably going to be there for a long time and they are going to see it when they walk by their shelf even if they don’t but that’s an impression where they’re thinking of you.
And so, you look at advertisers base there, you are an advertiser right? You basically base your success on cost per impression and so what’s my cost of impression of sending a book to somebody? Well if I am going to get a hundred impressions over the next three years because they keep walking back and forth by your bookshelf and it costs me 25 bucks to send them a book, you’d buy that Facebook ad. So that is the way that I am thinking now.
[0:43:10.6] RN: Are you selling more? I just jogged my thoughts, are you selling more for Amazon, are you selling more on Kindle or more on physical books because you talk a lot about physical books and giving tangibles things something that you can hold, feel, see, read, what do you sell most of?
[0:43:24.7] JG: Physical books number one, Kindle and Audible number two.
[0:43:28.0] RN: Really? That’s surprising to me. Is that the trend for most people?
[0:43:33.7] JG: So why I think it is, I don’t know what the trend is. We spoke about this before. I have no clue what anybody else does. It’s completely relevant to me what I am able to do, I pay no attention to it and I don’t even know if there are people in my industry doing incredible work like I have no clue what they are doing. I am happy to meet them and talk to them about it but –
[0:43:49.9] RN: You don’t spend your time on it.
[0:43:50.8] JG: It doesn’t matter. All that matters to me is that I do the best work that I can possibly do day in and day out and if I do that then –
[0:43:57.6] RN: It will take care of itself.
[0:43:58.6] JG: It will take care of itself and if it doesn’t then I’ve done my best. I think what I do is very different with any books like fiction books are very different than non-fiction books. Non-fiction books people generally like A, show off that they bought the book. I get a lot of gym owners buying books and stuff like that and giving them to their staff. I got a lot of parents buying the books over the holidays because my book ranks well for a lot of topics.
Over the holiday sales go way up like parents buying their aspiring personal trainer books because I think of that physical is much greater than like a Kindle or Audible and with us Audible like fitness professionals love audio because they do a lot of cardio and stuff like that so they like audio books a lot and so I did two of them in audio. I had a voice actor do it because I was in the middle of nowhere.
[0:44:45.6] RN: I see, there’s the audio issue right?
[0:44:47.3] JG: Well exactly so Personal Trainer Pocketbook and Ignite the Fire, I put them out at the same time. The second version of Ignite the Fire, I put them out at the same time and I kid you not, this is the craziest story, I marketed the book from an off the grid eco home in Uruguay in a tiny area in Uruguay and the first time I held the book, I was a month and a half after it had gone up for sale and I was in a hostel in Brazil. My brother bought a copy of the book for me from Vancouver.
And we were just about to leave for a five day track in the Brazilian park called Chapada Diamantina and that was the first time I had held my book that I had created, right? This was like a two year journey and it sold thousands of copies before I had actually seen it. The proofing of the book was me ordering copies to my parents in Arizona who would speak with me on Skype and show me it and show me the left right disposition and the design and all that kind of stuff.
You can do this stuff now, why the heck would you not? It’s nuts even sending out the sample copies, like I was Uruguay, I was in Montevideo. I had to go to Juan Pedro who we went to the house named Jericho from which was a different house we lived in and I had to go to him and I had to ask him to translate and find me a print shop so I could buy paper and sticky notes and pens because nobody speaks English in Uruguay and the common stuff we could do.
But to find a print shop and communicate to them that you need stationery is not easy. So I got all of that, I wrote a 120 letters, we packed all the letters. I put it together in a book and I mailed that book through the Coheyo which is like the post office and I’m sure I have butchered the pronunciation but like post office in Uruguay and I mailed that quick to my assistant in Savanah, Georgia who then had all the books and put together the packages like I was telling you about with the sticky notes and stuff.
And so I load all the sticky notes, it was my handwriting. I typed all the letters but I signed all of the letters myself because that was really important to me and then I mailed them as a book to who they took a month to get to her. Those sample books went out late because I guess this should have been no surprise but the Uruguayan postal service is maybe not up to stuff like with North America and I don’t have no idea what was happening and the sent them out.
And by that point, we were in this off the grid eco home where the water is filtered by the garden and when it was cloudy for a day, nobody can use electricity. Why would you not do those things if you can? It’s nuts.
[0:47:30.0] RN: Yeah, no it’s crazy how you can do this stuff from anywhere. It’s amazing.
[0:47:35.4] JG: An adventure, if you’re okay focusing on that and not thinking that you need to be everywhere and anywhere. Even like the podcast tour for the book, I need to do all my calls basically from four to 7 AM because the internet was so crap. This was this house named Jocko in an area called Puntorubia up the coast in Uruguay. This was a different house where I did most of the podcast. I recorded them all in advance.
The internet by the time it was 8 AM was so bad that I couldn’t do anything and so I would wake up and pop half a caffeine fill and do these podcast appearances and blasting them all. It’s ridiculous but like the marketing wasn’t as good as it maybe would have been otherwise but man, was it an adventure.
[0:48:23.6] RN: But you’re living off the grid, that’s awesome.
[0:48:25.8] JG: Right.
[0:48:26.7] RN: So I know you have mentioned a mentor. You mentioned your parents, you’re married, if you had to pinpoint one person, who would you say has the most profound impact on your life?
[0:48:38.2] JG: I mean now is my wife by far. She’s the best supporter. I learned things by talking through them in circles over and over again.
[0:48:47.4] RN: She’s your sounding board?
[0:48:48.3] JG: There is nobody else who has patience to listen to it. We’ll go for a two hour walk and I’ll say the same thing over and over again 30 times and she won’t walk away from me.
[0:48:58.7] RN: Is it give and take or is she just there to listen?
[0:49:01.7] JG: I mean she asks great questions. It’s give and take, she compliments me in a lot of ways which I think any good relationship will have. I am very much somebody who acts – she’s the person who asks the questions later who just thinks about all these crazy things and just decides to do them without thinking. She’s a strategist, she is an organizer, she is really good at putting pieces together and we just complement each other really well.
She’s like, “Oh yeah and then this works and the other this way” and I’m like, “Yes it does. Yes it does, that’s great” so by far her. I mean there’s growing up, my father and I were very close and my father still is very close. We go ride our bike and we go in the summer when he’s back and we’d go for coffee a couple of mornings a week and just sit by the water and chat and he’s helped me with a lot of stuff that I hate which is financial stuff.
[0:49:52.2] RN: Right, sure I am right there with you.
[0:49:54.0] JG: Yeah, so I pretty much don’t have a mind for that. I don’t know, money comes in and I do stuff with it. He’s like, “Well you are spending like a few hundred thousand dollars a month. You need to figure this stuff out” and I’m like, “Oh no, whatever, money goes out”.
[0:50:07.6] RN: Yeah, money goes out, money comes in.
[0:50:09.4] JG: Yeah, isn’t that the way the world works? If we lost the power, money flows. I’ll keep it flowing and so he helps me with a lot of stuff like that but no, my wife Alison, she’s just super special and my biggest supporter and my biggest fan and my best friend and all those good things.
[0:50:24.2] RN: So obviously you shut down the membership site, I’m sure you have more book ideas in the pipeline, what are you most excited about right now in terms of the future in the horizon?
[0:50:34.2] JG: You say book ideas. I am not writing a book for a while but my issue is now –
[0:50:39.4] RN: That’s what every author says when they write a book like the next month.
[0:50:42.3] JG: Shit dude, my problem is right now I know what it takes to write a book and to publish a book and to market a book that I am so petrified to do it again. It’s one of those things that it needs to get so painful right?
[0:50:56.0] RN: That the idea has to come out?
[0:50:57.5] JG: Yeah, so I’ve got files in my computer. I’ve got I think seven folders in my computer, I think seven different books and just whenever I think of anything for them come across the study or whatever resource, I just throw them in there. There is one of them that’s rearing its ugly head more and more.
[0:51:10.9] RN: See? I told you, it’s how you come out.
[0:51:13.3] JG: Oh man but like I said, it needs to get painful to do it and I think a lot of writers will say that. No we’re working on a startup is kind of I guess is an off shoot of the PDTC of my website and that’s what the entire team is focused on with self-funding it from start to finish. That’s what we’ve been working towards, the ability to self-fund it and it’s super exciting. It’s something that I think will really impact the fitness industry in a really good way.
I think that the fitness industry is a really good place. I think it also has a lot of problems and I think a lot of the problems are solved by again, how do you solve or how do you fix something, you need to really firmly identify the problem and I think we’ve done that. We figured out that basically all of these stupid stuff that happens in the fitness industry and people selling crummy supplements and jokey-tease and multilevel marketing and crappy gyms that don’t take care of people.
Basically all of those things happen because trainers and fitness professionals need to figure out a way to make a bit more money in a bit less time with a bit better schedule. That’s the problem and so online training is a great solution for that for some trainers but online training really only appeals to trainers who are a little bit introverted, who can sit in front of a computer. So it’s not for everybody and so what we’re building out is effectively a market place.
Where we’re turning each trainer into both a producer and a consumer and so trainers who have done stuff really good for themselves can make money by working to educate other trainers and coaches and we’re just decentralizing how that’s done. So that’s what gets me really excited today and it’s a ridiculous ambitious audacious project and all of those fun things but –
[0:52:48.1] RN: When is it expected to be launched?
[0:52:50.0] JG: If we hit our goals, you can see the white board here. It is some of the planning stuff beside us which of course nobody else can see. So it’s annoying when people say that in the podcast. There is a white board beside us everybody. It has a bunch of really amazing brilliant things on it that you won’t be able to see.
[0:53:03.2] RN: His master strategy plan.
[0:53:04.5] JG: Exactly and it is everything that you ever need to know to make millions and millions of dollars. Yeah, it’s too bad he’s not filming this.
[0:53:10.9] RN: Oh that’s a shame.
[0:53:12.0] JG: We’re hoping to have the Beta site live on October and then early in the New Year, probably February or March is when we go live because once the Beta site is live we’ve got to do the whole bunch of content acquisition and stuff through chaos and monkeys do it, try to break it and hopefully, February or March because it is user generated it has the ability to scale very, very quickly. There is a whole bunch of problems with scale and you know, you can’t grow too fast.
If you do grow too fast with stuff like that, it can be a much bigger problem than not growing so we’re making sure we are controlling that stuff in order first.
[0:53:45.4] RN: Awesome, can’t wait to see the progress and check in with you when it’s getting closer to launch.
[0:53:50.5] JG: Yeah, we’ll see. We got ways off but it’s going to get so far.
[0:53:54.4] RN: I am going to respect your time man but thank you so much for hosting me today and I really enjoyed the conversation.
[0:53:58.5] JG: Cool. Thanks bro.
[0:53:59.6] RN: All right, see you.
[END OF INTERVIEW]
[0:54:03.2] RN: All right, so you could find Jon at jonathangoodman.ca, he’s @jon_ptdc on Twitter and of course, all the links and resources Jon and I discussed including more information on his books and businesses can be found on the page created especially for this episode. You’ll be able to find that on failon.com/016 and keep an eye out for our next episode to follow this one.
We’ll be sitting down with Chris and Eric Martinez, twin brothers behind the business Dynamic Duo Training. These guys have built an incredible brand and business in the fitness industry but have very valuable advice regardless of what industry you’re in or what industry you wanted to get started in. So you don’t want to miss it.
And as I continue to build this project with the simple goal of getting people to once and for all decide that they are going to fail their way to creating an inspired life, if you could do one thing to support the cause I’d be ever so grateful. When you click on the subscribe button and leave a rating and quick review, this simply allows the podcast to be visible to more people. To rate and review the podcast, it’s really easy, just go to failon.com/itunes or failon.com/stitcher.
[0:57:46.1] ANNOUNCER: That’s all for this episode of The Fail On Podcast. For more resources, show notes and action items to help you find success in your failures, sign up for our mailing list at failon.com.
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